are you saying a human fetus deserves even less respect than an animal to be slaughtered?

yes I eat meat, yes when your trying to lead a cow from the barn to the slaughter house often times they do everything they can to escape back into the barn.

escaping into the barn, escaping into the womb, seems about the same.

This post was edited by Ylem122 on Apr 9 2014 12:12am

Pain is a purely psychological experience, from sensations from the nerve endings to the gate in the spine which informs the brain to signal discomfort (to warn you that something is wrong).

Before the spine and brain are developed it is impossible to experience pain, or anything at all.

Once that stuff matures and organs work, the spine is functioning, and the sensory organs are all sending their inputs in...then it is a being. Before this it isn't alive in any way outside of a cellular level.

So whenever it is that the spine, brain, and sensory organs are all in order is when pain can be experienced. Fear likely not. Fear requires some comprehension. Needing both is largely irrelevant and causing either would be a big problem in my eyes.

But it needs that stuff that is possible.

I'm derailing this thread I'm sorry.

This post was edited by Skinned on Apr 9 2014 12:11am

its real easy, put some caustic liquid on its finger and note gestures made to remove it. then put some non caustic liquid and note any gestures made to remove it.

if the child wipes away the caustic liquid but does nothing to the non caustic, the person should be respected as such.



its the kind of test they did to prove that Crustatans with out a spine, like lobsters and crabs, do feel pain even though they don't have a spine.

This post was edited by Ylem122 on Apr 9 2014 12:16am

The ability to experience pain develops long before birth.

Post from January 2012, lol, when I identified as a “mutualist.”

It is anarchists and libertarians that are the reason their very own fantasy ideologies cannot ever exist.