It was reported previously [8] that the behavior of free electrons in superfluid helium has again forced the issue of the meaning of the wavefunction.

Electrons form bubbles in superfluid helium which reveal that the electron is real and that a physical interpretation of the wavefunction is necessary.

(electrons have a position that is definite and not spread across a continuum of values)

Furthermore, when irradiated with light of energy of about a 0.5 to several electron volts [37], the electrons carry current at different rates as if they
exist with different sizes.

It has been proposed that the behavior of free electrons in superfluid helium can be explained in terms of the electron breaking into pieces at superfluid helium temperatures [37].
Yet, the electron has proven to be indivisible even under particle accelerator collisions at 90 GeV (LEPII).

The nature of the wavefunction need to be addressed. It is time for the physical rather than the mathematical nature of the wavefunction to be determined.

I hate you.

Unless, of course, if two electrons interacting constitutes a "measurement" and the wavefunction collapses just from that. For example, the solution to the Schroedinger's Cat paradox is that the Geiger Counter detecting radiation (or not) constitutes the measurement which collapses the Cat's wavefunction.

Here's what David Griffiths concludes his Quantum Mechanics textbook with. I added the bold toward the end to emphasize what is probably the most relevant sentence, but really the whole thing is cool enough to be repeated.

Point taken. So do you think that the electron bubbles in the superfliuid helium would mean a collapse of the wavefunction? Also, what do you think about there being a level below ground state for the electron in hydrogen? The man who wrote the OP claims that he has done this and replicated it in different labs.

i just googled superfluidity and holyshit thats awsome

same, very cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z6UJbwxBZI

This post was edited by penguinhero on Nov 22 2010 11:37pm

Well, that electron bubble is proof that the electron has a definite position. I would guess that it means that the superfluid helium's interaction with the electron constitutes a measurement which collapses the electron's wavefunction, but I can't say for certain. That's my Bachelor's degree's opinion


Well this is the first I've heard of anything. Have a citation? I'd like to try to read up on it but I don't see anything from scholar.google.com. Must be some very new work? I'd be hesitant to accept it until it's been peer reviewed though, instead of just repeated by the same guy. It's possible it's a systematic error in his method or theory rather than a systematic error in his equipment.

Still though, below the ground state? Is he he detecting photon emissions corresponding to energies greater than ~13.6 eV? I don't really understand what it could mean for there to be something with a lower energy than the ground state. I'd say it meant the electron was captured by the nucleus, but that's already a known type of radioactive decay (and I think only happens in much heavier atoms, since electron + proton neutron + energy, so a hydrogen atom would just become a neutron).

Aetheric doesn't know anything.

His primary sources of information are wikipedia and some fringe internet theorist who promotes something called "aether wave theory" (whom as far as I know, knows just as little). He likes to believe it, like a religious person, because it's not in the mainstream and it's promoted in a manner which makes aetheric believe that he's "above" the hivemind of mainstream thought. Diagnosis: he's a religious person.

When I say he doesn't know anything, I mean he has no idea how any of these ideas fit into the bigger context or how they're supported scientifically and mathematically. He doesn't have a formal education, and he probably hasn't even bothered to read an introductory physics textbook.

So yeah, you're more likely than not arguing with a brick wall.

This post was edited by Djsenn on Nov 23 2010 05:31pm

I don't accept the Aether Physics Model as it has too poor and too little empirical evidence supporting it. I do support what this thread is about, and the idea that there could be lower than the ground state for hydrogen. I don't have an education in physics yet, but I can still discuss it with other people, just like how most people on PaRD don't have an education in certain issues and they still discuss them.