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Mar 13 2013 08:33am
Quote (Ir0nside @ Mar 13 2013 01:21pm)
ive got 250+ BvB duels in... and id have to say thats prolly not the case but ... meh

i unno how in a bvb either of u are living past zerker?? my hota crits for 2500+ and has just under 75% chance to crit in zerk... :S i jus pop it asap and shit hota...

if u stun lock me im jus gunna pop zerker when i get 50 fury... even if u IP the first 5 seconds, having high IAS aint helping u while im not able to be CC'd for 15...? And it wont give Hota / Rend more damage. i unno. i guess if u both tank type specs the highest ias might work?


First of all, your crit chance for all intents and purposes is abysmally low. You can easily have a duel where ur hota won't crit at all. So you need zerk to get those big numbers.
Second, you need fury to get. If u get stunlocked u will never get to 50 fury. If you do, whoever ur fighting is bad or doesn't have enough AS. Also, you have many other skills besides IP to survive extra seconds or allowing escape so it really won't ever be a full 15 second that you can just go and freely do whatever u want. On top of that, if you manage to escape stunlock and if you manage to get 50 fury after that, the other guy will have full fury aswell so you will both be in wotb.

Either way, attackspeed is very relevant.

That said, Orvar and I both think there is no such thing as an effective tanking spec for barbs. It is really overrated. If you take a spreadsheet and calculate the difference between a 9-10k hp dmg barb and a 13-15k hp tank barb statistics will show that ur damage is so bad that u will lose to the dmg barb most of the time since his dmg relative to ur hp take less time for a kill then it would if you were both dmg spec.

Tank spec serves as a win more spec vs things you should already be winning against imo.

Edit:

Also, I checked ur barb but you must be miscounting. You get 5% base crit, 5% ruthless, 2% off ur bonds and 10% for using an axe. Total of 22. With WotB this is 32%. How do you get to 75% crits?

This post was edited by tcpgeest on Mar 13 2013 08:47am
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Mar 13 2013 08:39am
Quote (tcpgeest @ Mar 13 2013 03:33pm)
First of all, your crit chance for all intents and purposes is abysmally low. You can easily have a duel where ur hota won't crit at all. So you need zerk to get those big numbers.
Second, you need fury to get. If u get stunlocked u will never get to 50 fury. If you do, whoever ur fighting is bad or doesn't have enough AS. Also, you have many other skills besides IP to survive extra seconds or allowing escape so it really won't ever be a full 15 second that you can just go and freely do whatever u want. On top of that, if you manage to escape stunlock and if you manage to get 50 fury after that, the other guy will have full fury aswell so you will both be in wotb.

Either way, attackspeed is very relevant.

That said, Orvar and I both think there is no such thing as an effective tanking spec for barbs. It is really overrated. If you take a spreadsheet and calculate the difference between a 9-10k hp dmg barb and a 13-15k hp tank barb statistics will show that ur damage is so bad that u will lose to the dmg barb most of the time since his dmg relative to ur hp take less time for a kill then it would if you were both dmg spec.

Tank spec serves as a win more spec vs things you should already be winning against imo.


Couldn't have said it better :hail:
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Mar 13 2013 10:48am
Quote (tcpgeest @ Mar 13 2013 10:33am)
First of all, your crit chance for all intents and purposes is abysmally low. You can easily have a duel where ur hota won't crit at all. So you need zerk to get those big numbers.
Second, you need fury to get. If u get stunlocked u will never get to 50 fury. If you do, whoever ur fighting is bad or doesn't have enough AS. Also, you have many other skills besides IP to survive extra seconds or allowing escape so it really won't ever be a full 15 second that you can just go and freely do whatever u want. On top of that, if you manage to escape stunlock and if you manage to get 50 fury after that, the other guy will have full fury aswell so you will both be in wotb.

Either way, attackspeed is very relevant.

That said, Orvar and I both think there is no such thing as an effective tanking spec for barbs. It is really overrated. If you take a spreadsheet and calculate the difference between a 9-10k hp dmg barb and a 13-15k hp tank barb statistics will show that ur damage is so bad that u will lose to the dmg barb most of the time since his dmg relative to ur hp take less time for a kill then it would if you were both dmg spec.

Tank spec serves as a win more spec vs things you should already be winning against imo.

Edit:

Also, I checked ur barb but you must be miscounting. You get 5% base crit, 5% ruthless, 2% off ur bonds and 10% for using an axe. Total of 22. With WotB this is 32%. How do you get to 75% crits?


32% + u get 3% more from battle rage, 10% from revenge if u use it, = 45% and clearly... u have no clue u get 1% crit chance per 5 fury u have on HoTA do you? ... obv not..... full fury = 70% crit chance on Hota in Wotb = "just under 75% crit chance on HoTA"

1/30 duels i dont crit with hota, maybe.

neways, ill guess well have to duel to see if IAS beats raw stats? i wouldnt even use clobber in bvb tbh, i wouldnt use revenge either, but that still puts hotas at 60% crit, and all the fury i have is gettin dumped into hota, and rend refresh.

your crit chance for all intents and purposes is abysmally low, except hota, with an axe. ;) cutie.

But we both know u werent waiting for 100% fury to drop hota now dont we? may that be why u dont crit every duel.... hmmmmmm?

This post was edited by Ir0nside on Mar 13 2013 11:14am
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Mar 13 2013 10:51am
Quote (Ir0nside @ Mar 13 2013 05:48pm)
32% + u get 3% more from battle rage, 10% from revenge if u use it,  = 45% and clearly... u have no clue u get 1% crit chance per fury u have on HoTA do you? ... obv not..... full fury = 70% crit chance on Hota in Wotb = "just under 75% crit chance on HoTA"

neways, ill guess well have to duel to see if IAS beats raw stats? i wouldnt even use clobber in bvb tbh :P.


If you're home right now, could you check if ptr is up?
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Mar 13 2013 10:53am
Quote (Orvar @ Mar 13 2013 12:51pm)
If you're home right now, could you check if ptr is up?


Have to install it on this PC before ill know, switched recently so thats why im not sure.
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Mar 13 2013 11:22am
It's not up
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Mar 13 2013 12:17pm
Quote (Ir0nside @ Mar 13 2013 04:48pm)
32% + u get 3% more from battle rage, 10% from revenge if u use it,  = 45% and clearly... u have no clue u get 1% crit chance per 5 fury u have on HoTA do you? ... obv not..... full fury = 70% crit chance on Hota in Wotb = "just under 75% crit chance on HoTA"

1/30 duels i dont crit with hota, maybe.

neways, ill guess well have to duel to see if IAS beats raw stats? i wouldnt even use clobber in bvb tbh, i wouldnt use revenge either, but that still puts hotas at 60% crit, and all the fury i have is gettin dumped into hota, and rend refresh.

your crit chance for all intents and purposes is abysmally low, except hota, with an axe. ;) cutie.

But we both know u werent waiting for 100% fury to drop hota now dont we? may that be why u dont crit every duel.... hmmmmmm?



I see your point but it feels as if it it's alot of if's and maybe's that you are counting on. AS is something reliable that always provides the same benefit.
Also my barb can't duel yours as it's not high geared enough too provide a good base for testing. Orvar's barb is however. If you can test your build and his AS build on PTR then we might be able to establish what works better.

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Mar 13 2013 04:39pm
Quote (Ir0nside @ Mar 13 2013 04:48pm)
1% crit chance per 5 fury u have on HoTA do you?mm?

the fuck? is that a hidden passive from hota?

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Mar 13 2013 05:59pm
Quote (WereWolf12345 @ Mar 13 2013 10:39pm)
the fuck? is that a hidden passive from hota?



No it's in the skill description actually.
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Mar 13 2013 06:14pm
Quote (tcpgeest @ Mar 13 2013 11:59pm)
No it's in the skill description actually.


wow... gg
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